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| New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? http://worldworksgames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=12715 |
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| Author: | mproteau [ 08-01-2014, 06:37 PM ] |
| Post subject: | New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
I finally had the chance to do real mockups of a couple different simplifications of the roof/truss system that TLX uses. I'm cautiously optimistic that it will prove to be as useful as the existing system, but much faster to build, and more flexible to use. Is anyone interested in taking a PDF with some blank templates and trying out the build process to offer some opinions? These are non-TLX templates that I've created from scratch, and I'm currently using them with non-WWG textures as well, but if they're well received, I'd likely be making versions using the WWG textures so it'd be easier to combine my sets. Drop me a PM if you're interested and think you'd have time in the near future to try a couple pieces. Here's the basic idea of what I did. I had a couple iterations. I've only done a 6" big roof, but I see no reason what I've done won't work with the other roof styles. I might mock up another piece or two, but I'd rather hold off until I get a better feel for how what I've done will hold up. Attempt #1: Rather than construct the trusses with built-in posts, I just made flat triangular walls with flaps on the sides. On the flaps was a slot so that the roof could attach in much the same way a wall slips into a post. The key thing I wanted, however, was for the slot to be right against the wall texture, so the roof completely abutted the wall. This eliminated the need for the truss to have roof tile textures on it to match the roof itself. Now, the trusses can be made once, and used with any roof texture! Why I don't think this is good enough: The bottom of the trusses tended to pull away from the roof, making it look quite sloppy. I wanted a way to make the roof piece really hug the edge of the truss. Attempt #2: I added a hole for a tab at the bottom of the roof piece. This is in addition to the slot at the top. This meant first slipping the roof into the slot, then popping the roof's tab into the second hole at the bottom of the truss. This kept the truss from sliding out from under the roof, and the results look promising. Why I think this idea might not work: The process of sliding the roof in and then popping in the extra tab might be a little fiddly. I personally don't mind it. My 9 year old found it more confusing than the normal TLX roofs, but he eventually picked up the idea. Attempt #3: I ditched the top slot and replaced it with a tab. So, each side has two tabs that just slip into the truss. As long as they don't tend to pop out, I think these are easier to assemble and make a little more sense. On the other hand, the style in #2 won't just pop out. Why I think this idea might not work: I'm not sure if the tabs will pop out easily when you don't want them to. Other than that, it seems to be a great solution. |
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| Author: | ScrubKai [ 08-02-2014, 08:42 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
I have no time to build but am very interested in how this turns out. My scheuduke is going to be crazy for the next year, but after that I plan on cranking out a bunch of roofs. If there is a better way to build them, I'm all ears. |
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| Author: | mproteau [ 08-04-2014, 06:56 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
After many failed attempts, I think I've settled onto a format that I like. What I've got is a "High Big Roof" replacement, and a 1-way truss to go with it. Next step is to shrink it down to a small roof, and after that, a 2-way truss. It's true, what I've settled on has spots that are untextured. Specifically, I've eliminated the post-like rectangular bits of the TLX roofs. I suppose I could add something like that back. The real key was just putting the right kind of slots/tabs so that the roof would cover up well enough the outer parts of the truss that formerly were textured like the roofs were. If anyone wants to give it a try, drop me a note. |
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| Author: | joydyhee [ 08-06-2014, 07:12 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
I am testing mproteau's new roof system out. Here are some shots from my preliminary build. I used 100# cover stock and Staples permanent glue tape. I like this roof setup. These are easy to build. I have not glued the truss supports on yet as I am having trouble keeping them closed. It may be my adhesive so I will try something else if they do not stay assembled. From a functional standpoint, the larger tabs make it a bit cumbersome to add or remove the roof sections quickly and elegantly. I suggest making the larger tabs "unhooked." They could stay the same size or be small as well. In one of my pics, I show how I clipped the tabs. Yes, it may not hold if you lift the whole assembly by that one section, but it holds together fine when assembled and is a breeze to add or remove. Side view of the roof. Peak view of roof. Inside view of roof (no truss supports installed yet). Close-up view of peak fit. Close-up view of ridgeline overlap. Attempt to keep truss support together while gluing. Modification of original tabs to be "drop-in." |
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| Author: | mproteau [ 08-06-2014, 07:23 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
Thanks for giving it a try! I dropped you a PM describing some of the iterations I've made, but folks can check out my ongoing struggles on my blog: http://paperdungeon.blogspot.com/ I wonder if I removed 1/4" from the top of the top tab, but keep it something that slots into place, whether that would work well. It'd be easier to get into the hole, and the notch really helps to hold it in place. My problem overall with the two simple tab approach was that they pop out of the truss too easily. From your first pic, try this - rather than letting the flaps at the top overlap each other, try folding them in tightly in between the two flaps of the truss. They'll press against each other and fill in the gap pretty nicely, and I think the result might look cleaner. As for the support piece for the truss... I use plain white glue for this. I put a thin layer completely covering one of the outer sections, then I fold it into a triangle and hold it against the table until it sets. Once that's done, I put another thin layer of glue on it to adhere it to the truss. I glue it so that there is a ledge on the bottom of the truss, making it rest easily on an anti-warp TLX wall. Ultimately, when this is textured, the tabs will have coloring in that area that might peek out, as will the truss flaps. Here's an example picture using some non-TLX terrain in a TLX build: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Tfbq7GAFb2k/U ... /photo.JPG |
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| Author: | mproteau [ 08-06-2014, 05:08 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
OK. This will be easier than trying to PM different folks... If you're interested in trying these out, here are the latest sample templates: https://www.dropbox.com/s/whmlxfodmetgz ... m_try4.pdf https://www.dropbox.com/s/oy5hlviacsfg2 ... _try4b.pdf That'll get you a "high big roof" and a "low big roof" (in TLX parlance) and trusses to go with them. Instructions are close to non-existent, but hopefully you'll figure it out. Please drop me a note if you do try them out and tell me what you think! P.S. I'm cross-posting this on the cardboard-warriors forum - it's a little more active than here, and there's common enough interest. |
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| Author: | sdavies2720 [ 08-07-2014, 09:46 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
| Author: | Zenguy [ 08-08-2014, 12:54 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
I've been following this (subscribed to the blog) with serious and growing interest as it looks like you've come up with a really good improvement to TLX. (So much interest, in fact, that I'm already thinking up enhancements to ask for once you get the tabs finalised.) I'm working on another project (writing not building) that is taking all my free time, otherwise would be offering to help with the testing. Keep up the awesome work 
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| Author: | joydyhee [ 08-08-2014, 02:24 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
| Author: | mproteau [ 08-08-2014, 05:30 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
Here's my latest blog post comparing the old and new roof pieces: http://paperdungeon.blogspot.com/2014/0 ... s-new.html I tried making shorter slotted tabs, but they just don't seem to hold the roof down as well. If you print out a truss and roof without cutting the notches, you can play around with the depth and see if you like it better. I can try to package up some of the previous attempts I've made if you want to give them a try, but I'm trying to filter out that stuff so you can focus on trying the formats I prefer...  I'm going to move onto some of the other roof pieces now, assuming that the slot-and-tab is good enough on the large piece, and the single slot on the small piece is ok too. I don't want to be paralyzed with ideas as there are always ways of tweaking things, and it could never end. I still would love ideas though, with this or anything else. I just want to continue to make progress. After looking at this, I might decide to texture the flaps on the trusses, just to hide them a little. I could even make them wrap into a box, like old TLX trusses. Basically, clean up the cosmetics of the pieces. It might not be as simple as folding it over like a TLX truss, simply because then the wrapped up cardstock will be in the way of the slot. I'm not out of ideas on this one yet though. Please, if you have major gripes about the roofs, let me know and I'll try to address them! |
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| Author: | mproteau [ 11-20-2014, 06:55 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
Ok... for the roofs... After all that tinkering and tweaking, here's where my head is at now. Leave the trusses and roofs as-is. That's right. No change. If you've built trusses for any sets, GREAT! However, I'll make rectangular pieces that can be attached ON TOP OF the roof pieces you've already made. They'll basically be a 2x thick rectangle (but not quite) that will extend over the tabs that slip into the trusses. This means, it will cover the roof texture on the trusses themselves. WIN! It's 2x thick because I'm lifting the layer up a little bit so it clears the truss better. If/when I do my own roofs, I'll likely make original style as well as roofs with no top texture. That'll save ink in case you're into my new method. I'm on vacation through the end of November, so I am really hoping to finish this up! |
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| Author: | Zenguy [ 11-20-2014, 11:52 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
Sounds good. Will that work for new structures and people who haven't built TLX before? Or will they still need to build the standard TLX trusses in addition to as well as the new roof covers? |
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| Author: | mproteau [ 11-20-2014, 12:12 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
| Author: | mproteau [ 11-21-2014, 11:18 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
Yay. So, the normal TLX roof pieces are textured. Onto the trusses. |
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| Author: | Alexio [ 11-21-2014, 02:59 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New, simpler roof/truss system, anyone? |
Very cool idea, sir. I'm way swamped with (real life) work but the stuff you come up with gladdens my spirits (some day I'll be able to make them!). |
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